Steve G.

G.E. (no longer) live in Denver: Posthumous report

In Libertarian Party-US on May 27, 2008 at 7:33 pm

First, I want to offer my apologies to Elfninosmom for not being able to provide more coverage while in Denver.

I left off Thursday night after the Libertarians for Justice event. The next morning, a strange thing happened: I got put to work.


I manned the Mary Ruwart booth for much of the day. This is when I first got to really meet Mary, and she shocked me by asking me to giver her a nominating speech. I was afraid to say yes, but I couldn’t say no. I would be horribly nervous and dreading the idea of it for the next 48 hours.

I had lunch with Tom Knapp. He bought. He told me about an apparent attack on George Phillies the night before — I mean a real attack — by an armed gunman. I never found out anything more about this, and inexplicably, I forgot to ask George when I saw him.

A little later, Andy and I ran into the WWE wrestler, Kane. Andy talked him up. He was very knowledgeable about wrestling, and Kane was impressed. Andy asked Kane which candidate he supported, and Kane pointed his thumb at the Ruwart booth. “You support Mary Ruwart?” Andy asked for clarification. Kane shook his head affirmatively. I later told this to Lee Wrights and we made several efforts to build a bridge with Kane without being too pushy. The day of the voting, Kane gave me a big thumbs up after my speech and I noticed he was wearing a Mary Ruwart button.

But back to Friday: This was the night of the big “unofficial, all-inclusive” debate. I have to say I would have much preferred a “mostly inclusive” format, rather than all-inclusive. Candidates without even two supporters don’t need to be heard. This includes both the crazy (Imperato and Alden Link), as well as the sane and principled candidates with no support whatsoever (Jim Burns).

If there were any doubts (and I don’t think there were), Imperato firmly established himself as batshit crazy during the debate. Wow. Paulie was sitting next to me and cracking jokes all night long. The whole audience snickered and outright laughed every time Imperato would go into long multi-lingual rants — “Must be he bought Dondero’s book,” Paulie said — or bragged of his connections (knows George W. Bush very well, partner with bin-Laden, has adopted nephews and nieces in Abu Dabai who call him “Uncle Dammy”). Imperato would also redirect every financial, fiscal, or monetary issue to his theory of Jacob and Esau, whereby Arabs were now jealous of the Jewish money mastery.

Alden Link: What a waste of time. Totally not libertarian in the least. Energy socialist. Monetary moron. Literally supported the “military industrial complex” in both name and spirit. Bigoted against Muslims. For the war on terror. Paulie said, “New rumor: Alden Link is Eric Dondero’s grandfather.”

Jon Finan was the only candidate (other than Barr) not in attendance. I did see him on Sunday on the convention floor. I don’t know why he didn’t show at this debate, but I’m glad he didn’t.

You can read more about the debate at the following links:

Immediately after the debate, an older gentleman started a conversation with me about Mary Ruwart. I asked if he supported her. He said, “Yes, but I’m from Massachussiets, so George is going to be upset if he finds out I support Mary–Oh, George, nice to see you!” Phillies had been standing behind me and the guy hadn’t noticed him. Whoops.

I stuck out my hand to have Phillies shake it. I introduced myself. “Oh, you‘re G.E.,” he said. “You forgot to tell people that I eat hard-boiled babies.” I apologized for some of the over-the-top things I had said about him online, and he graciously accepted. I hope I have learned my lesson: Online opponents are real human beings.

Afterwards, I took U.S. Senate candidate from Michigan, Scotty Boman, out to dinner at a local bar with loud music. I screamed my order, “hamburger!” but was brought an amber lager instead. That worked.


At the previous night’s dinner with Scotty Boman, I was shocked to learn that he didn’t know about Bob Barr’s leadership PAC. I decided this information had to get out there, so a new conspiracy was born. Mary Ruwart’s sisters had flown in to manage the booth, allowing me some free time. I needed it to work on my speech, but I planned to do some covert ops, too. I recruited Andy and a Gravel supporter with whom I had become friendly to do the wet work. Elfninomom’s research would be printed out and circulated on the convention floor.

First problem: No access to a printer. I stopped by the radical booth and tried to enlist the support of Susan Hogarth (and her printer), but she was very busy and a bit perturbed. She had an LNC election to campaign for and was under much stress. Paulie Cannoli said I should ask . . . one of the presidential candidates if I could use his/her printer. Luckily, I had recently mended fences with this particular individual, and he/she said yes. The person in charge of his/her printer was currently on the LNC floor, but a covert rendezvous was arranged and he/she gave me 200 copies of the anti-Barr dossier.

Next, I had to get them to Andy and my Gravel friend. I carried them in a satchel and inconspicuously made the drop. I had planned to write a blog title called “How Elfninosmom, G.E., Andy, Gravel supporter, [name redacted], and [name redacted] saved the Libertarian Party” if Mary or Steve or someone good had won. But alas. . .

The debate: You undoubtedly saw it on TV, so there’s no need for me to recap it here. I will say that people within the Ruwart campaign were not thrilled with our candidate’s performance. It sucks because Mary is unbelievable in intimate settings. In fact, she gave a speech earlier that day that brought one woman to tears. Our booth was flooded by people exchanging the buttons of other candidates for Mary’s. And one guy gave us a $2,300 contribution that he wanted processed right away so that he could make another one post-nomination. That’s the impact Mary can have when she’s not sharing the stage with boisterous alpha males. And guess what: Along the campaign trail, people don’t debate over and over again — they talk to small groups. Mary would have been the best candidate the party has ever seen.

Saturday night: Wanted to go out drinking but I had the speech to think about. I went up to my room early and practiced the hell out of it. I chopped it down until it was barely over a minute long (I was given two minutes). No way I’ll be pressed for time. . . Or so I thought.


I had to wake up at 7:00 a.m. The campaign staff were meeting at the booth at 8:00. Then at 9:00, I had a meeting with the Michigan delegation — thankfully, this got me out of hauling signs from Mary’s hotel room to the convention floor. (Sorry, Steve LaBianca!).

The meeting with my delegation was to discuss how we would vote. Leonard Schwartz, a fairly conservative libertarian, began, and I expected him to support Barr. Nope. “The worst thing that could happen is a Democratic Congress and White House, and that’s what we’ll have if we nominate Barr,” he said. “Anybody but Barr.” Then the Gravel guy started speaking. . . and didn’t stop for a long, long, long time. Dude, get a clue and STFU. Bob Barr wanted to speak to our delegation, but no one wanted to hear from him. Of our 26 votes, 12 were for Mary on the first ballot, 13 on most subsequent ballots, and by the end, we were 16-8-1 (Mary-Barry-NOTA), with one guy disappearing. Michigan stood by Mary. It should be noted that Nevada gave Root zero votes, as Alaska did for Gravel.

But I’m getting ahead of myself. . . My speech: Thanks to everyone who said it was good. Jesus, I was nervous. I had a knot in my chest for at least 12 hours prior to the speech, and when it was over with, the knot felt like it dropped into the pit of my stomach. I thought I was going to be sick. As stated earlier, Kane gave me a big thumbs up and, more importantly, Angela Keaton did. Susan Hogarth gave me a hug.

You all know what happened on Black Sunday, so I won’t relive the gory details. I will tell you about one incident I’m not very proud of, though. When Root dropped out and backed Barr, I shouted “NEOCON!” Some dude turned around, and I don’t remember what he said to me. It might have been “Shut up” or “Shut the fuck up” or “Shut up, asshole!” but I do remember my response. “Hey, fuck you!” The guy stormed at me. He told me to get out of his face or he’d kick my ass. I told him I had free speech and he was threatening the initiation of force. He said I had initiated force by telling him to “fuck off” (which I hadn’t, but I didn’t argue the point). I told him that by threatening to initiate force, he was in fact initiating force, and that my words had made no such initiation. Soon we were bogged down in semantics to the extent that we both walked away. I’m sure non-libertarians would get a kick out of this.

When we had officially lost, we all took the stage so Mary could recognize us. I was proud that she stuck by principle. There had been overtures for her to compromise and align with one of the two camps. These men, or at least their employees, has slandered her good name. She would not back down. That’s the type of person we need as our candidate.

We shook the hands of our opponents. I congratulated Bob Barr. There were no dirty tricks by Barr and his people at the convention. (Beforehand is another story). Earlier, I finally confronted Steven Gordon when he came to wish Mary good luck. “I heard you’re angry with me,” I said. “Yes, you called me a neocon.” I told him I didn’t think I had, but I apologized either way. He accepted, and seemed to be sincere in his acceptance. Hopefully that beef is squashed. After his victory, Gordon, Barr, and the whole camp, were totally professional and did not gloat in the least. I can’t say I would have been the same way!

We hit the hotel bar. Someone offered to buy us some drinks. Thomas Hill abstained, but Mary and I each had a Diet Pepsi. We were confronted with numerous well wishers. One woman, with whom Mary was acquainted, urged her to seek the VP slot and run an independent campaign. Mary wasn’t interested at first, but the more she thought about the independent aspect, the more her interest was peeked. Ultimately, there just wasn’t enough time to consider things, and she had already given her support to Kubby’s run for VP.

As for Kubby’s run: Every Barr person I know supported him. What does that say about my sample? I appreciate those who tried to extend the olive branch.

After it was all over, the campaign took its staffers and trusted volunteers out for one final dinner. Lee Wrights, Thomas Hill, Brian Irving, myself, Steve LaBianca, and Mary’s husband, Ray. Thomas Knapp was also invited to come along, as were Mary’s sisters and her nephew. Everyone but I was dressed casually — I packed light and took only suits. The atmosphere was much different, and I downed to Dos Equis. Lee Wrights and Thomas Hill were both moved to tears at various times.

I got separated from the pack when I entered into a discussion with Skyler McKinney (great guy). Then Paulie Cannoli confronted me and say, “Are you drinking?” Of course! We hit the hotel bar for something a little stronger than Diet Pepsi. I downed 1.5 Coronas and then Angela Keaton and Michelle Shighall (can someone get me the correct spelling there, please!) came by and asked us to go somewhere else with them. Paulie went but I stayed. I had to get up early to catch my flight.

On my way back from the bathroom, I ran into Jake Porter. I gave him a hard time about supporting Barr and pretended I was mad at him, but how can you be mad at the guy? Then I saw Jeff Wartman, and I invited the two guys back into the bar so I could finish my last beer before going up to bed. As if.

Wartman, Porter, and I came up with the central piece of a unifying platform: A resolution to condemn Eric Dondero. I drank three more beers, for a total of six, before the bar closed at 11:00 p.m. I was about to go upstairs when Susan Hogarth started banging on the window from the outside, calling us out. A bunch of the radicals were going to another bar, and she wanted us to come. I was just about out of cash. She offered to buy, so of course, I couldn’t say no.

Long story short: I did a lot more drinking. Susan Hogarth complimented me and ripped me at the same time: “You did so great today with your speech . . . When I saw you get on stage, I thought ‘What is Mary thinking?'” But she made it up to me with free beer and two sisterly kisses. This complemented the (also sisterly) kiss I received from Angela Keaton earlier in the day.

By the time I got to bed, my flight would be leaving four hours later. Ouch. I’m just now recovering. Question: Will the party recover?

  1. Awesome report man.

    I’m going to try to make the Michigan Convention, a week and a half or so. Hope to see you there.

  2. Oh and for the record, I think you could take Gordon…

    Just kidding Steve, don’t come o’ looking for me next.

  3. Have y’all heard of the “more” tag?

  4. No, how do I do it?

  5. In the toolbar under “Post”, it’s the one to the left of the spell-checker.

  6. Thanks

  7. Thanks for the update, GE. 🙂

  8. GE,

    You were a friggin’ machine at the convention, worth your weight in gold to Mary’s campaign (which, for the record and now that I can admit it publicly, I’m proud to have also done a little bit of work for with Steve’s permission and knowledge). Good to finally meet you, and you’ll be on the short “we need these people” list I give to any campaign I work with in the future.

    A sisterly kiss from Angela is simultaneously pure as the driven snow and more decadent and erotic than a three-day booze and hooker binge in Tijuana.

  9. “Lee claims that Andy is a hot head — I think I can agree with that claim — and that, when Lee was Andy’s boss, he had to fire him over his conduct with people who wouldn’t sign his petitions. Lee claims Andy would say, “Oh, so you hate freedom and liberty!?” whenever someone wouldn’t sign his petition, and get in their faces.”

    This is a total lie from Lee Wrights. Lee is far more of a “hot head” than I’ve ever been in my life. Also, Lee was NEVER my boss, nor did he ever fire me. What really happened, was that I was on a petition drive in North Carolina and Sean Haugh made some false allegations about me and went into a beserk rage over the phone and hung up on me (Sean was at that time the Executive Director of the LP of NC). I called up Lee Wrights to talk about it and during the course of the conversation with Lee Wrights I asked him about an explanation for Sean’s crazy behavior by asking if Sean Haugh was a drug user. Lee was offended by me asking if Sean was a drug user and he screamed at me and hung up the phone on me.

    So if anyone “fired” me it was Sean Haugh, however, it was not legitimate and he in fact ripped me off out of money.

    I’m not sure who is more of an unstable nutcase, Sean Haugh or Lee Wrights.

  10. “Lee is far more of a “hot head” than I’ve ever been in my life.”

    That’s what I heard from a lot of people. As for my own experience, Lee treated me very fairly and seemed completely competent as Mary’s campaign manager. I have nothing bad to say about him at all. I do know he has rubbed people the wrong way, but so have you, and so have I. I remain neutral like Switzerland. Your experience, of course, is your own, and I don’t doubt your side of the story. Andy, I hope you get your money that you’re owed. It sucks to be owed money.

  11. Jason – I’ve broken my hand three times in fights, in 8th grade, then a freshman in college, and then 2003 (the last time was not a fight, actually). Therefore, I can only jab with my left, I can’t throw my right.

    Steven Gordon seems like a good guy who has done a lot more for liberty than I have. If I can ever say I’ve done as much or more, then I will be proud.

  12. GE, I called Lee Wrights two times after he had screamed at me and then hung up on me for asking if Sean Haugh was a drug user. The reason that I called him twice after this was because prior to this, my interactions with Lee Wrights in North Carolina were friendly. So I wanted to call him to try to “patch things up” (even though I thought that his reaction to my asking in Sean Haugh’s crazy behavior was drug related was crazy in its own right). So I called Lee Wrights one more time before I left North Carolina (a few hours later in the day after he had yelled at and hung up on me) and then I called him a week later. Both conversations were friendly and Lee acted like he was on my side. In fact, Lee actually said that he didn’t think that I had done anything wrong and that if it was up to him I should have remained in North Carolina but that Sean Haugh was the Executive Director and that he had made an executive decision (kind of like how Presidents make illegal & immoral executive decisions) and that there was nothing that he could do about it. This was back in February of 2001. I didn’t have any contact with Lee Wrights after this until this convention.

    In late 2006 and early 2007 I was asked to go to North Carolina by LP Chairman Bill Redpath to help with their ballot access petition drive. I was also asked to go their by Scott Kohlhaas (who at that time hadn’t revealed himself to me as a crook and a weasel) as well as ballot access expert and long time Libertarian activist Richard Winger. I explained to them that I had a problem with Sean Haugh but they said not to worry about it, if they wanted me their it didn’t matter what Sean Haugh said. So I called up Bob Ritchie who was the LP of NC ballot access coordinator at that time and arranged a deal to come down there. Paul (as in Paulie who is a frequent contributor here) was also asked to go to North Carolina. Paul is a good worker but he is also a drivers license protestor and does not drive or own a car. I had agreed that Paul could ride and that I’d share a motel room with him. I explained to Bob Ritchie what had happened with myself and Sean Haugh and he sounded sympathetic to my side and he knew that Bill Redpath wanted me to be there, so the only detail that was left to work out was exactly how much money we were supposed to get for motels and whether or not my gas was going to be reimbursed for driving to North Carolina. Bob Rithie was supposed to call me back within one or two days with this information. Well, one and then two days passed and I didn’t hear from him, so I started calling him to see what was up. The only problem was that he didn’t call me back! I called him everyday for the next 10 days and he didn’t return my calls. Then I talked to a couple of other people who had told me that they had just spoken to Bob Ritchie so at that point I knew that he was avoiding me. So I called him several more times and fourteen days after he was SUPPOSED to have gotten back to me I finally got through to him. When I finally got a hold of him he said something like, “I’m sorry to inform you of this, but Lee Wrights – with the urging of Sean Haugh – voted against you petitioning in North Carolina and he got the committee to vote this way.”

    When I got this information from Bob Ritchie I was REALLY pissed off. Why?

    1) I had turned down other work opportunities in places such as California and Oregon in order to work the Libertarian Party ballot access drive in North Carolina. I didn’t turn down the other work opportunities because the LP of NC ballot access drive was going to be more lucrative – the work that I had turned down was probably more lucrative – I turned it down because I LIKE to work on Libertarian Party stuff when possible and because I wanted to visit the Carolinas region again and because a couple of my friends were supposed to be there, and also because I was ASKED to go there by some people in the LP such as Bill Redpath.

    2) This vote to keep me out was a total slap in the face as I am regaurded as one of the best petition signature gatherers in the country, and I’m also one of the few that is an actual Libertarian activist. I have a reputation for bringing in high numbers of signatures with high validity. I also have a reputation for doing LOTS of pro-liberty activism. Most of the people hired to do this type of work are mercenaries who don’t give a damn about the Libertarian Party or any other cause and many of them are scumbags. I can provide a list of references to back up my claims. Most campaign coordinators trip over themselves to bring me in to a campaign.

    3) I wasn’t suprised that Sean Haugh would stab me in the back since he had already proven himself to be irrational and a liar, but I had ASSUMED that I was still on good terms with Lee Wrights given that the only problem that I had with him stemmed from me asking if Sean Haugh was a drug user and I had thought that this “problem” had been “patched up” in those last two phone conversations that I had with him back in 2001. When Lee blocked me from working on the LP of NC ballot access petition – with the urging of Seah Haugh – he PROVED himself to be a two-faced backstabbing weasel.

    So I ended up being cheated out of two weeks plus where I could have been earning money over some petty bullshit. This cost me OVER $2,000 in opportunity costs (and this is probably a low estimate).

    In addition to costing me money, this also cost Paul money as he had to work in North Carolina without a car, which makes the job much more difficult. For those of you who don’t know, finding locations where you can gather petition signatures without being hassled and kicked out can be quite challenging. Some states are worse than others for this and North Carolina is one of the more difficult states in this regaurd. Part of the deal that Paul had for this petition drive was that his motel room would be paid for by the party (which is a common practice). Since Paul was working without a car and without anyone to drive him around, he was struggling to get maybe 500 signatures per week. If I had been down there, it is quite possible that the two of us combined could have generated a good 2,000 signatures per week. Paul’s motel bill (which the party was paying for) came to around $350 per week. So if I had been there, that motel room bill COULD HAVE generated a good 2,000 signatures per week instead of maybe 500 signatures per week, thus making a more efficient use of party resources. I think that fellow party members should be pissed off that Sean Haugh and Lee Wrights caused party resources to be WASTED.

    Lee Wrights proved himself to be a true asshole and a chickenshit coward at the LP National Convention in Denver, and now he has proven himself to be a LIAR with the excuse that he gave you. You didn’t witness the entire confrontation, GE. I didn’t go up to him and start yelling. My approach was more along the lines of “Hey Lee, long time no see. Remember me from the North Carolina petition drive back in 2001?” and then I reached out and shook his hand. I don’t know if Lee remembered me at first or not but his initial reaction (before I brought up the fact that he had trashed talked (and lied about) me to Bill Redpath and blocked me from working) was not hostile. He became hostile AFTER I said that I had heard that he trashed talked me to Bill Redpath and asked him why he blocked me from working on the North Carolina ballot access drive. Notice how Lee was screaming and running away and threatening to have security throw me out (even after I had informed him that I was a Mary Ruwart supporter). Is that the reaction of rational person?

    I was disappointed when Bob Barr won the Presidential nomination over Mary Ruwart, but there was one silver lining to this cloud and that is that the ASSHOLE Lee Wrights didn’t get to be the manager of a Presidential campaign, a job which he most likely would have fucked up anyway. It made me sick to see Lee Wrights walking around with Mary Ruwart. I’d be willing to bet that if Mary Ruwart knew about the other side of Lee Wrights that she wouldn’t have wanted him working on her campaign.

  13. Yes, Glenn Jacobs (aka-Kane) was a very cool guy. I spoke to him 3 times during the convention and not only was he friendly and down-to-earth, he is also very knowledgable and passionate about libertarian politics. This guy would make a GREAT candidate for office and I told him so. He seemed hesitant about seeking office, especially since he has a low opinion of most politicians (with the exception of somebody like Ron Paul).

    I saw Glenn”Kane” Jacobs talking to Lee Wrights towards the end of the convention and from what GE said above, it sounds like my conversation with him in the prescence of GE is what lead to that conversation. Just as I felt like puking everytime I saw Lee Wrights with Mary Ruwart I felt the same reaction when I saw this mentally unstable North Carolina weasel talking to Kane. I wish that Lee had talked shit to Kane and that Kane would have choked slammed his ass on the convention floor. If Glenn ever decides to enter politics I hope that he stays away from the likes of Lee Wrights.

  14. I witnessed the Lee Wrights/Andy sparring and have to say that it was Lee who lost his composure first.

    My impression is that Lee is a hothead who doesn’t mind destroying someone’s reputation by his hotheadedness, if that’s what it takes.

  15. “Lee claims that Andy is a hot head — I think I can agree with that claim — and that, when Lee was Andy’s boss, he had to fire him over his conduct with people who wouldn’t sign his petitions. Lee claims Andy would say, ‘Oh, so you hate freedom and liberty!?’ whenever someone wouldn’t sign his petition, and get in their faces.”

    You know, I already thought that Lee Wrights was a jackass before this, but this BLATANT LIE from him makes my opinion of him sink to an even lower level. This is really pathetic. Lee doesn’t have anything legitimate on me so he’s got to resort to making something up.

    When I am out gathering petition signatures, my goal is to get as many good signatures as possible. Why would I bait people into arguements when that only slows you down and increases the risk of getting hassled and kicked out of locations? This makes no rational sense. If a person doesn’t sign the petition it is in my best interest to get rid of them fast and move on to the next person. I may anwser a few questions or try a few different angles to get them to sign (depending on the situation), but I do NOT make nasty comments to them because that is actually counterproductive.

    Have I ever gotten into arguements with people? Sure, but this is the EXCEPTION rather than the rule. If you are out there gathering petition signatures for 8-10 hours plus per day, 7 days per week, for weeks at a time, then you are bound to get into a few arguements here and there. However, the fact of the matter is that on the occassions when this happens to me it is because I ran into a person who was extremely hostile to the petition or to free speech or is just flat out nuts. I don’t go looking for trouble, but when you are collecting signatures on a petition trouble often comes looking for you.

    I challenge anyone here to grab some clip boards and some pens and go out for the next few weeks and try to collect thousands of petition signatures, be it for Libertarian Party ballot access, a pro-liberty initiative or referendum, a recall, or a plebicite (a non-legally binding petition). Find out for yourself how many people in the general public are hostile or are apathetic.

    In addition to it being against my own self interest to try to avoid getting into arguements with people to illustrate that Lee Wrights is full of shit, the fact of the matter is that LEE WRIGHTS NEVER SAW ME GATHER PETITION SIGNATURES WHEN I WAS IN NORTH CAROLINA OR ANYWHERE ELSE! For that matter, nobody from the North Carolina LP ever went out and watched me collect signatures. How can Lee Wrights even comment on my petition signature gathering when he NEVER saw me work?

    Anyone who actually knows me and especially those who have worked with me can tell you that Lee Wrights’ accusation against me is pure bullshit.

    I gathered over 4,000 signatures during the 4 week period that I worked there and I did this without a car and during bad weather and with limited access to locations to work. This is actually pretty damn good as any expierenced petitioner and/or petition coordinator would tell you.

    Lee Wrights has got a hell of a lot of nerve trash talking me. How many petition signatures has he ever collected? In how many states has he collected petition signatures (I’ve done 24)? How many times has he stood out side in freezing cold weather or extreme heat for hours on end collecting signatures? How many times has he had to deal with blockers (people who don’t like your petition and try to prevent you from getting signatures), hostile and apathetic members of the public, hostile cops, security gaurds, store managers, and government bureacrats? I bet that Lee Wrights sucks as a petitioner (if he’s ever even done it). I could probably work circles around him.

    Let’s put it this way, if you needed to get on the ballot and you still needed 1,000 signatures and you only had a week left, and you could call me or you could call Lee Wrights, who would you call?

  16. Andy-

    Quit you’re whining—-get over it.

  17. And by the way—I’d call Lee for those signatures.

  18. Oh–one more thing—Lee only talks shit to those who are full of shit.

  19. “Brooklyn Says:

    May 29, 2008 at 10:50 pm

    Quit you’re whining—-get over it.”

    OK, then pay me the money that I got screwed out of including opportunity costs and interest.

    “Brooklyn Says:

    May 29, 2008 at 10:52 pm
    And by the way—I’d call Lee for those signatures.”

    Then you’d be a fool. I’ve collected over 100,000 signatures and am regaurded as one of the top petition circulators in the country. This isn’t a reputation that is earned easily.

    “Brooklyn Says:

    May 29, 2008 at 11:48 pm
    Oh–one more thing—Lee only talks shit to those who are full of shit.”

    Who are you, Lee’s butt buddy?

  20. I should not have stirred the pot with my account of this confrontation, and I apologize to Andy and everyone else who was effected by it. I have deleted it from the post.

    In my own defense, I was just journaling my observations and experiences in Denver. But I should have thought about it for more than ten seconds and realized it would do no good to chronicle this particular incident.

  21. Hey Andy, when are you coming to Illinois? Your buddy Eric Dondero is already here petitioning his heart out.

  22. I’ve worked with Andy all over the country. I’ve never seen him act in such an unprofessional manner in the field as he quotes Lee as saying about him in these comments.

    How he acts when he isn’t working may sometimes lead one to believe he is a hot-head, but that has nothing to do with his petitioning technique.

    As for Lee Wrights, I haven’t seen his bad tempered side either. I don’t know him nearly as well as I do Andy, but thus far he has always been at least civil with me.

  23. “In addition to it being against my own self interest to try to avoid getting into arguements with people to illustrate that Lee Wrights is full of shit,”

    This should read, “In addition to it being in my own self interest to avoid getting into arguements with people to illustrate that Lee Wrights is full of shit,”.

  24. “pauliecannoli Says:

    May 30, 2008 at 7:44 am
    I’ve worked with Andy all over the country. I’ve never seen him act in such an unprofessional manner in the field as he quotes Lee as saying about him in these comments.”

    It should be blatantly obvious that Lee’s comments about me are bullshit because if I really did what Lee claimed I wouldn’t make any money and I never would have made it in this business. There is no way that I could have gotten over 4,000 signatures in one month during harsh conditions in North Carolina if Lee’s claim was true. The fact of the matter is that Lee’s claim is baseless. In fact, I suspect that he made it up on the spot just so he could provide an excuse to GE.

    “How he acts when he isn’t working may sometimes lead one to believe he is a hot-head, but that has nothing to do with his petitioning technique.”

    I generally only get angry when somebody pushes me, such as through backstabbing, lying, or cheating me out of money. It is not as though I walk around angry all the time.

    The only instances where I got angry at the National Convention were in regaurds to confrontations with people who’ve screwed me over in Sean Haugh, Lee Wrights, and Scott Kohlhaas. I gaurentee that if anyone else here had been screwed over by these individuals as I’ve been that you’d be mad as well.

    “As for Lee Wrights, I haven’t seen his bad tempered side either. I don’t know him nearly as well as I do Andy, but thus far he has always been at least civil with me.”

    Lee Wrights seemed civil when I first met him, but first appearances can be decieving. His reaction back in 2001 to my asking if Sean Haugh’s crazy behavior was drug induced – as in screaming at me and then hanging up the phone on me – was quite frankly nuts. Lee’s actions in 2007 and 2008 towards me proved him to be a back stabbing two-faced chickenshit weasel as well as a liar and an asshole.

    He must have done a good job snowjobbing Mary Ruwart. I bet that if Mary Ruwart knew what he’s REALLY like she wouldn’t want to have anything to do with him. The fact that Lee is now on the National Committee is a total joke. This is an example of why the Libertarian Party doesn’t get anywhere.

  25. “Chris Bennett Says:

    May 30, 2008 at 5:37 am
    Hey Andy, when are you coming to Illinois? Your buddy Eric Dondero is already here petitioning his heart out.”

    I assume that you are being sarcastic, but just in case anyone wonders, I’ve never met Eric Dondero in person. I’ve spoken to him on the phone twice (in regaurds to a petition drive) but that’s it.

    I’ve disagreed with Eric Dondero over some political issues on-line and I’ve heard some stories about him but since I’ve never met the guy I can’t comment from personal expierence.

    I know people who I have disagreements with politically who I get along with just fine. I don’t know if Eric would fall into that category or not.

  26. Andy—
    Do you need some sort of medication to help you calm down a bit? Give it a rest. We know you hate Lee—who cares?

  27. It should be blatantly obvious that Lee’s comments about me are bullshit because if I really did what Lee claimed I wouldn’t make any money and I never would have made it in this business.

    Not so obvious at all, although as you know I have worked with you a lot and never seen you do anything like that.

    However, we both know at least two people who have, and have been able to make a living in this business nevertheless. One of them is me, as I’m sure you remember the North Korea anti-pitch I told you about using (a lot) in 2001. The other one was our roommate in Columbus, Ohio.

  28. “However, we both know at least two people who have, and have been able to make a living in this business nevertheless. One of them is me, as I’m sure you remember the North Korea anti-pitch I told you about using (a lot) in 2001. The other one was our roommate in Columbus, Ohio.”

    I’ve rarely seen you mouth off to anyone while in the field. The same thing with the other guy.

  29. “Brooklyn Says:

    May 30, 2008 at 1:13 pm
    Do you need some sort of medication to help you calm down a bit? Give it a rest. We know you hate Lee—who cares?”

    I care and so should everyone else. Why? Because this mentally unstable lying weasel Lee Wrights is on the LNC and was the campaign manager for Mary Ruwart. Seriously, this clown shouldn’t be in any such position.

  30. Mary thinks so—and she knows more about him than you’ll ever know.
    Wah wah wah!!! This is becoming quite humerous…..

  31. “Brooklyn Says:

    May 30, 2008 at 8:03 pm
    Mary thinks so—and she knows more about him than you’ll ever know.
    Wah wah wah!!! This is becoming quite humerous…..”

    That’s because he’s a phony and a suck up who kisses ass if there is a person who he thinks can get him ahead (ie: Mary Ruwart), but will not hesitate to shit on somebody if he thinks that he can get away with it.

    Also, notice that Mary didn’t win the nomination. Perhaps she would have won had she had a better campaign manager.

  32. Dear Chris Bennet,

    Andy is unfortunately legally prohibited from working in IL on the IL LP petition drive, because he gathered signatures for me in IL this year for placing Republican Ron Paul’s primary delegates on the ballot in IL. (BTW: Andy is a great petitioner with a reliable track record, who has more patience than most petitioners I’ve met. He does hold people accountable when they try to rip him off, which is not such a bad characteristic, since his work is above reproach.) According to Scott Kohlhaas, and Sean Haugh (as well as the unconstitutional and illegitimate laws of the State of Illinois), circulating for both Ron Paul and the IL LP would be illegal. IL law ( Sec. 10-4 of the Illinois Election Code, Ill.Rev.Stat. ch. 46 Sec. 10-4 ) says a US citizen may not circulate petitions in IL for more than one political party per election. Although this court case: ( overturns the IL law, the IL LP will certainly back down from challenging the IL law, since they lack enoguh funds to pursue justice and freedom of speech in the Soviet Socialist State of IL.

    A 1986 court case ( ) upheld the IL law as precedent. Since the 1988 Colorado law is a later conflicting precedent in another State, this case would likely go to the mental midgets at the Supreme Court, if anyone had the money and caring for a long, drawn-out battle for free speech in the Soviet Socialist State of IL, and beyond.

    These precedents were not researched and found by me, but given to me by the expert, Richard Winger, of Ballot Access News. I strongly recommend that people who want to be well-informed of electoral goings on in their own states read BAN, located online here:

    Sorry if my little test to see if I can use HTML doesn’t work out above. Hopefully, y’all will figure out where the links point, even if it doesn’t.


    Jake Witmer
    PS: Please send people who need loans, cash advances, or insurance to my homepage (we can also finance Alcor life-extension policies with life insurance for any and all futurists out there). For the next several years, my efforts will go to FIJA/leveller/libertarian/copwatch activism in the fine state of Indiana (ideally uniting those efforts into a more effective new organization centered around jury rights). With every dollar of commission I make, and with every dollar of referral money that you receive from me when a deal closes, the libertarian/anarcho-capitalist/leveller movement grows stronger. Thanks.

  33. It all depends on what is meant by “acting in such an unprofessional manner” (as to whether or not I’ve engaged in it).

    Do professional wrestlers, for example, act “unprofessionally” when they mouth off about their opponents on national TV? Certainly, I’ve rarely said anything so vehement when I’ve petitioned as a (professional) wrestler has.

    I suspect that in less than 1% of the people I’ve encountered in my petition duties (probably far less than that) have I uttered a negative or sarcastic word to someone who refused to sign, and invariably, those in that small minority deserved to be put in their place, verbally.

    One needs to remember that nonsigners are not to a petitioner that customers are to a merchant or service provider. In business, the “customer is always” right, the saying goes. But someone who doesn’t sign my petition gets no benefit of that doubt and, although overwhelmingly most of the time I let them slide without comment, the small minority who are hateful or arrogant about their non-signing can fuck off, go to hell, or kiss my ass; they are NOT my customer. In fact, they have no relation to me whatsoever.

    I’d say a far worse problem would be if a petitioner badmouthed the SIGNERS of his petition, even a small percentage of the time. Signers and nonsigners are profoundly different to a petitioner and have profoundly different roles and benefits of the doubt. Any petitioner who badmouths a SIGNER I think, is definitely unprofessional; however, I’ve never witnessed anyone do such a thing, including Andy. And if it’s rare when Andy makes a parting comment to a nonsigner (aren’t we supposed to have free speech anyway?) then why is there a problem and why is this an issue?

    I’ve NEVER popped off at a signer, and rarely (when you consider how many nonsigners I encounter) pop off to a nonsigner. Yes, I’ve done it to the most arrogant of them, and am unrepentent about it.

  34. So there you have it from some people who actually know me and have actually worked with me, unlike Lee Wrights who NEVER even saw me gather petition signatures, much less actually work with me.

    Slandering a person’s repuation with lies is the mark of a true scumbag. Trash like Lee Wrights should not hold any positions within the party.

  35. You are really becoming a bore, Andy.

  36. “Brooklyn Says:

    June 1, 2008 at 5:05 pm
    You are really becoming a bore, Andy.”

    If you aren’t interested, don’t click on the thread.

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